As frustrated Victorians endure a fourth lockdown, businesses across the country are hurting; is it time we learnt to live with COVID long term? What risk are we prepared to live with? Plus a look at the trade war tensions between Australia and China. Joining Hamish on the panel are: Omar Khorshid, President, Australian Medical Association; Kamalini Lokuge, Epidemiologist, Australian National University; Peter Hartcher, Political Editor, The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age; Sally Scales, APY Art Centre Collective Regional Programs Coordinator and Uluru Statement Leadership; and Cameron Murray, Economist and Research Fellow.